"Words that convey emotion".... This is actually something I've wrestled with a long time. I've slowly learned, despite my very limited vocal ability, that the best way to find that "prosody" is to simply sing the lyrics first and then make the music fit. To me, when you throw words at music, it always sounds the same... but when you throw music at a natural melody that the words themselves create then something special happens! 🙂 

I totally agree, Tony. Working with John, I have had to learn to write songs after the music has, largely, been written because he is always writing and I can't keep up with the music machine. On some occasions we flip the table and I get in there first. This to me is the best way to get a strong melody because the options are uncountable. When I write to already existing music, there are really only a handful of choices to be made. There are fewer options for the melody.

You're up late brother! Sheesh!  : ) 

Took a nap on a lazy Sunday afternoon.... now I can't sleep lol ? 

Doh!

Getting the best PROSODY for your lyrics  ??   I can only achieve that  if I constantly

listen to the playback ,  the answer to getting it right is   How Does It Sing and  is it the right emotion

Every  phrase has to compliment the phrase  it  follows or precedes,   as  one bad phrase  can

ruin the whole song .   I sing my own songs , so It's handy if you are an all round vocalist , 

If we write lyrics without any idea of the Music and Rhythm , it will  only produce

endless re writes,  I often abandon a particular melody or simply modify it.  

Put it to one side and sleep on it  is my answer,  I use Guitar and  Keyboard 

in the process , there will be songs you abandon   that's part of the process  

Great thread Jen, Tony, and Peter, you have probably helped any new writers who are willing head this advice.  No matter how finished one might think lyrics and music may be, keep working it over, I guarantee you are likely to find a flaw.  When you think you have nailed it, get some advice from a trusted source or sources.  Thank you all for sharing, good luck and best wishes,

Speak soon

Totally agree Peter and Deacon. Taking what you both have said a step further, whenever I've taken a writer's lyrics to apply melody and arrangement, I've always found it easier to work with those lyricists (like Carroll or Paul, for instance) who are willing to seriously consider lyric suggestions. If a lyricist holds fervently to their words, it can be very hard for  a songwriter to achieve prosody. It's like writing with the brakes on -- you're forcing the song rather than just letting it flow.

Great article! I have Jason Blume's, "6 Steps To Songwriting Success" and have read it once. A long time ago! I really should go reread parts of it again.

phil

So.... Now the obvious question. How does prosody apply to rap? ? 

Ah come on now "T", can't you give us a simpler question, like ah, "what is the meaning of life"?

Very interesting!!! Thanks for sharing. Personally, I do not have a system, sometimes I do lyrics first and then the music and sometimes I do the lyrics listening to a piano, a layer, a guitar, or a rhythm I choose previously. Rhythms are something very important to my emotional state, they give me a special skin, a special way of feeling.

Mora

AS far as JASON BLUME'S   book that you refer to its not the best around by far 

he writes songs without basically playing or having knowledge of a musical 

instrument ; okay he had success of a sort  but nothing outstanding that stays

in the memory;  of course  he goes over the basics and that is okay for a beginner

But Tunesmith by Jimmy  Web  PLUS  the Excellent  books  by Sheila Davis are a

must  for serious song writers   it all depends on your own natural abilities  as to what

books are best for you

Hey Peter, with all due respect, I'd like to correct a couple things you said about Jason Blume.

I've known Jason for quite sometime. He actually used to "Gherm" me (trying to get to know a more established writer for your own reputation) me years ago when he first moved to town. He's actually a very nice guy and very knowlegable and has had quite a productive career. Not only has he had dozens of country hits but also Brittany Spears and the Backstreet Boys in pop music. He actually knows his stuff,and we've done quite a few workshops together. He is a fount of knowledge and has done everything he tells other people to do.

The other thing is that he actually DOES know his way around a guitar. I know because I performed with him in Lake Tahoe at a workshop we both did in 2006. I was under the same assumption, that he did not play an instrument and asked him about that. He didn't perform out, and I thought he couldn't play. He said that he didn't because he didn't really consider himself a singer, and years before overseas, he had lost confidence in his abilities and just quit playing for several years. I kind of guilted him into actually pulling out a guitar and playing a couple and I was REALLY surprised. I thought he would SUCK, because I've been aroujnd some mega hit writers who made that same claim and sure enough, THEY DID SUCK. But not Jason. He actually was quite good, sang very well and attributed himself well. But he was not totally comfortable in doing it, tripped over a couple of lines, (which his audience actually knew, so he got through that when they sang them, LOL!) but he does actually know what he is talking about.

In his section of the workshop, (there were eight of us Nashville pros involved, and oddly enough, I was presenting on LIVE PERFORMANCE) he discussed PROSODY, and demonstrated it on a couple of popular songs, in a way I had never quite thought of before. He also did it on one of his own songs, a country artist John Berry song, (I can't remember which one but I had a John Berry cut too so that stood out in my mind)  but it was a pretty good demonstration.

So I would have to say Jason does live up to what he is talking about. He knows his stuff and uses it. He might not be THE AUTHORITY, I don't know who is, but he is a pretty good one in my opinion.

Hey Marc, thanks for that input, and sticking up for Jason. I don't really "know" Jason, but I was actually in one of his lectures during an NSAI Spring Training, years ago, and also did not realize he played guitar. In that lecture, he talked about how when he first started, he worked with a cowriter who could put his lyrics to music. BUT, he was the one who determined the prosody. I do have Jason's book, and it really helped me once upon a time. I would recommend the book even to more experienced writers, just as a refresher.

phil